English flagItalian flagKorean flagChinese (Simplified) flagPortuguese flagGerman flagFrench flag
Spanish flagJapanese flagArabic flagRussian flagGreek flagDutch flagBulgarian flag
Czech flagCroat flagDanish flagFinnish flagHindi flagPolish flagRumanian flag
Swedish flagNorwegian flag     
By N2H
欢迎raph koster的个人网站: mmos ,游戏,写作,艺术,音乐,书籍。

Alternatives To Second Life 替代第二生命

April 13th, 2007 2007年4月13日

Onder Skall has a nice post up entitled Alternatives To Second Life - Uber Edition which runs down lots of “metaversey’ style worlds. onder skall有一个好职有权选择第二生命-产品版背道而驰下降很多“ m etaversey作风的世界。 There are a few historical ones he missed that are still running, I think, and he missed a few upcoming ones that I think are of interest as well: Whirled and Ogoglio .有几个历史的他错过仍在运行,我认为,他错过了几个即将举行的那些我认为是有兴趣,以及: whirledogoglio

More interesting is that list of three core requirements that he sees an SL-like world as needing to have:更有趣的是,名单中的三个核心的要求,他看到了一个晚上八样的世界,需要有:

  1. Real money must move in and out of the “virtual” economy freely. RMT (Real-Money Trading) is designed in, not forbidden by TOS. 真正的金钱必须在进出该“虚拟”的经济自由。区域管理小组(真钱交易)是在设计上,而不是禁止的服务条款。
  2. Users must be able to create unique content and retain ownership over it. Things like scripting and accepting uploads are important here. 用户必须能够创造出独特的内容,并保留所有权。事物一样,脚本和接受上传的是这里重要的。 Multimedia is a bonus.多媒体是一个花红。 We must be able to control the rights to our content.我们必须能够在控制权,我们的内容。
  3. The world must be persistent, and the users able to change it. Residents like being able to build the world themselves, and don’t need somebody stepping in and erasing their work. 世界必须持久,和用户能够去改变它。居民一样,能够建立世界本身,并不需要有人在加强和擦除他们的工作。

This is a nice, endlessly debatable list.这是一个很好,无休止地争论性的名单。 Right off the bat, I think that #1 is probably the most problematic (do you become a bank, terrorists laundering money, tax implications, illegal business activities, and on and on and on).正确的小康,蝙蝠,我认为# 1可能是最有问题的(你成为一个银行恐怖分子洗钱,税的影响,非法业务活动,并和上和对) 。 #3 has been around for a while for lots of worlds. # 3已经靠近了,而对于大量的世界。 And as I have mentioned previously, the real rub on #2 is actually whether you are submitting your IP content to the world provider and having them claim ownership or just a perpetual license (if you use their tools and their format, you are surrendering control of the data no matter what).正如我前面提到的,真正的摩擦就# 2 ,其实无论你是提交您的IP内容,向世界提供者和拥有他们索赔的所有权或只是一个永久许可证(如果您使用他们的工具和其格式,你是投降控制有关数据无论什么) 。
FWIW, I think that #1 is a bit of a red herring. fwiw ,我认为1号是一个位一个红鲱鱼。 The point of a metaverse world, or indeed any sort of world including the real one, is not to make money.点一metaverse世界,或什至任何形式的世界各地,包括实质一,是不是为了赚钱。 Money is an enabler, a convenient tool.金钱是一个创造,一个方便的工具。 I suspect that the current explosion in “metaverse service bureaus” is a sign that RMT is not the key ingredient involved in making big bucks with a virtual world.我猜想,目前爆炸案“ metaverse服务局”是一个标志,区域管理小组是不是关键因素参与了决策赚大钱与虚拟世界。

*

[?] [ ? ]
You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed.您可以按照任何的反应,此项目通过2.0饲料。 Responses are currently closed, but you can trackback from your own site.反应目前关闭,但您可以跟踪从你自己的网站。

20 Responses to “Alternatives To Second Life” 20的反应“替代第二生命”

Jump to reader comments » | Leave a reply » 跳转到读者的评论» | 离开的答复»

Trackbacks & Pingbacks trackbacks和pingbacks
  1. Alternatives To Second Life - Uber Edition « Second Life Games wrote on 替代第二生命-产品版«第二生命游戏写就2

    [...] style worlds. [ … … ]风格的世界。 There are a few historical ones he […]      by Raph’s Website » Alternatives To Second Life April 13th, 2007 at 11:41 [...] 有几个历史的他[ … … ]由raph的网站 » 替代第二生命2007年4月13日在11时41分[ … … ]

  2. Project Good Luck wrote on 项目好运写就

    #3 about persistence and impact of user play appears, to my eyes, to be a universal if we are talking about virtual world design…but already there are qualifications if non-sandbox worlds are included. # 3关于持久性和影响用户发挥出现,我的眼睛,是一个普遍的,如果我们所谈论的虚拟世界设计… …但已经有资格,如果非在Sandbox世界均包括在内。 Anyway, have a go and add to the list. 无论如何,有一个去添加到列表。 Thanks Raph Koster for the heads up on this. 感谢raph koster为元首了这一点。

  3. thcrawford wrote on thcrawford写就

    the common tools with the use of 3D visualization. 共同的工具,使用三维可视化。 For groups such as designers, manufacturers, claims adjusters, and others that need 3D, this is the easy choice. 为群体,如设计师,制造商,索赔理算师,和其他需要三维,这是很容易的选择。 For a look at a number of other virtual worlds, check out Raph Koster’s article on Alternatives to Second Life, and the original source article from Onder Skall. 为看看其他一些虚拟世界,签出raph koster的文章关于替代第二生命,原始来源的文章,从onder skall 。

  4. Mind Booster Noori: Predicting the tech-future wrote on 记强心针努:预测技术的未来写就

    [...] Warcraft) is to be the ultimate MMORPG. [ … … ]魔兽)是要最终mmorpg 。 Oh, and the nobody-knows-what-this-is extremely-hiped areae isn’t going to have persistence, which is a big no-no for me (even if I usually agree with his vision on VW’s.Last but not least [...] 哦,和无人不知什么-这-是非常- hiped areae是不会有持续性,这是一个很大的,没有不为我(即使我通常会同意他的抱负,大众的。最后,但并非最不重要的[ … … ]

  5. bwl zwei null » Ihnen gefällt es nicht in Second Life? wrote on bwl zwei空» ihnen gefällt部nicht在第二次生命?写就

    [...] aktuelle und sehr umfassende Liste aller künstlichen Welten zusammengestellt. [ … … ] aktuelle und sehr清单umfassende阿勒尔künstlichen welten zusammengestellt 。 Wirklich aller? wirklich阿勒尔? Nun, Raphael Koster hat da noch ein paar (wenige) Ergänzungen und [...] 尼姑,拉斐尔的帽子,达koster noch艾因paar ( wenige ) ergänzungen und [ … … ]

Reader Comments 读者评论
  1. Patrick said on 帕特里克说,

    I actually take issue with “Persistence” in the conventional sense of 3d spaces, and if I infer from your cryptic press materials correctly, so do you.其实我的问题,采取与“坚持”在传统意义上的三维空间,如果我推断,从您的潜新闻材料正确,所以你。 Home, combined with the lack of a Flash 9 client in Wii’s Opera browser, suggest to me that the consoles are not where the cutting edge is, or will be, at least this year and probably next as well.家,再加上缺乏一个闪光九客户端在wii的Opera浏览器,建议我认为控制台不是那里的前沿,或将,至少在今年和明年以及。

    Anyway, something like Whirled seems to be the cutting edge of this because of the agility involved, though I know about something even better.不过,无论如何,像whirled似乎是前沿阵地,这是因为所涉及的敏捷性,虽然我知道一些,甚至更好。

    Yeah Raph - how does it feel to have really cool proprietary information hinted at and then withheld from you?是啊raph -如何是否觉得有真的很酷的专有信息暗示,然后扣压从你呢? ; )

  2. Onder Skall said on onder skall说,

    Just a small note:只是一个小注:

    You are insightful, as always, but please keep in mind that this is about SL, not “virtual worlds” in the larger sense.你是有见地,一如往常,但请记住,在这大约是晚上八,而不是“虚拟世界”在较大的意义。 If I was talking in generalities I’d agree with you, but…如果我是说在泛泛而我要同意你的意见,但…

    Survey SL residents to see if they care about trading L$ and I think you might discover something here.调查二○ ○居民看到,如果他们关心的贸易升元,我想你可能会发现一些在这里。 This is about what current residents care about, after all.这是什么当前居民关心的,毕竟。

  3. Morgan Ramsay said on 摩根拉姆齐说,

    Survey SL residents to see if they care about trading L$ and I think you might discover something here.调查二○ ○居民看到,如果他们关心的贸易升元,我想你可能会发现一些在这里。

    That’s like saying, “Survey guitarists to see if they care about strings.”说的一样,他说: “统计调查的吉他手,看看是否他们所关心的弦乐团” 。

  4. Trevor F. Smith said on ( Trevor楼史密斯说,对

    I think web based VWs are the bee’s knees, but to be fair to Onder there isn’ta lot of easily digestible information on Whirled and Ogoglio.我认为基于Web的vws是蜜蜂的膝盖,但为了公平对待onder有不是很多,容易消化的资料whirled和ogoglio 。

    I’ll be interested to read what Onder posts after the veils are lifted.我将有兴趣读什么onder的职位后,面纱被取消。

  5. Kami Harbinger said on 上预示着说,

    RMT is important to a lot of people.区域管理小组是很重要的了很多人。 They’re almost all Second Life users right now, because it’s the only one that does all of Onder’s Three Laws Of Things That Are Exactly Like Second Life And Nothing Else.他们几乎所有的第二生命,现在用户的权利,因为它的唯一一个确实的所有onder的这三部法律的事情是完全一样的第二生命,没有别的。 And yes, it’s like asking guitarists if strings are important, but… Strings are in fact very important to guitarists.是的,这就象要求吉他手,如果字符串是重要的,但…字符串,其实是非常重要的吉他手。 When Joe Satriani writes Three Laws Of Things That Are Exactly Like Guitars And Nothing Else, strings will be way up there.当乔satriani写这三部法律的事情是完全一样,吉他和什么都没有,弦乐团将一路有。

    If you make a world that isn’t just a game, allows user-generated content, and is persistent, people will want to get paid for their creative work.如果您的世界,不只是一个游戏,让使用者产生的内容,是持续,人们会希望获得相应的报酬,他们创造性的工作。 If they can’t do it legally, they’ll do it illegally; if you make it inconvenient enough to do it illegally, they’ll go somewhere that supports them, and you’ll have no quality user-generated content.如果他们不能这样做合法,他们就会去做非法;如果您不方便足够做非法,他们就会去支持他们,而您也没有任何质量用户产生的内容。

    RMT has some legal issues, but they do appear to all be solvable with a lawyer and an economist.区域管理小组有一些法律问题,但他们似乎所有可解与一名律师和经济学家。 Game/virtual world designers generally aren’t either, so they should go get experts to help them rather than screw it up themselves.游戏/虚拟世界的设计师普遍不要么,所以他们应该得到专家的帮助他们,而不是螺丝钉,它自己。 This may come as a shock to certain game/VW designers who have created bad ecologies and economies without outside help before.这可能是来作为一个休克的某些游戏/大众设计师谁造成了恶劣的生态和经济没有外界的帮助,之前。 LL’s had the good sense to ask professionals what to do.当地雇员的有良好的意识,要求专业人士怎么做。

    The notion that the real world is not “about” making money is only true in the most facile sense, that the real world isn’t about anything, you make your own goals.概念,即现实世界中是没有的“关于”赚钱是唯一真正在最简易的意识,现实世界是没有什么问题,会让您自己的目标。 However, in practice almost everyone chooses a primary or secondary goal of making money, because it supports all of their other goals, or because they really do like money.然而,在实践中几乎每个人都选择一个小学或中学的目标,赚钱,因为它支持他们的所有其他目标,或因为他们真的喜欢金钱。 Second Life is a very, very thin layer on top of First Life, and people choose goals in remarkably similar ways there, there is no other “point” to it.第二生命是一个非常,非常的薄层对上方的第一生命,和人民选择的目标在显着类似的方式有,有没有其他的“点”给它。

    The “metaverse service bureaus”, as you call them, are not doing their work out of the goodness of their little sheepy hearts and love for making things with prims. “ metaverse服务局” ,正如你要求他们,都不会做他们的工作,出于对他们的善小sheepy心中的爱使的东西,与prims 。 They’re doing it because they want to make LOTS of money; more money than you can reasonably push through the current small SL economy, so they have to do it in US$.他们这么做,是因为他们要进大笔钞票;更多的钱比你可合理地推动通过这次小二○ ○经济,所以他们必须这样做,在美元。 I make a decent secondary income in L$ on the weekends, as do quite a few other people.我提出一个像样中学收入在升元,在周末,做了不少其他人。

    I’m quite sure that you’re not making Aeaeaea out of love for the world, either.我很相信您不是决策aeaeaea走出爱的世界,无论是。 You want some of the phat loot your former corporate masters made from your work.您想要部分的phat哄抢您的前企业的主人,从你的工作。 Don’t be ashamed of it.不感到羞愧。 It’s okay, that’sa good goal in life.它的好, that'sa良好的目标,在生活中。

    I disagree on the other points, as well, but that’s hardly a surprise: I’m using Second Life.我不同意就其他各点,以及,但几乎出人意料:我使用的第二生命。 If I didn’t like persistence, user-generated content, and property rights, I’d be somewhere else.如果我不喜欢毅力,使用者产生的内容,权利和财产权利,我要被别的地方。 If you liked persistence, user-generated content, and property rights, you wouldn’t be bothering with anything else, you’d be in Second Life, too.如果你喜欢的毅力,使用者产生的内容,权利和财产权利,你不会有任何困扰,否则,您在第二次生命,太。

  6. Prokofy Neva said on prokofy涅瓦说,

    What Kami said.什么上说。

    And kudos to Onder for sticking it out with his three simple criteria past the Scylla and Charybdis of game ideology at Terra Nova.和声望,以onder坚持出来与他的3个简单的准则,过去青蟹和布迪斯的游戏思想,在地面新星。

    RMT *is* what people want.区域管理小组* *是什么人想。 They want it so much they make it out of nothing in games that don’t even have loot by selling the accounts with their skills.他们希望这么多,他们使出来,从无到有,在游戏,甚至不用哄抢出售的帐目,与他们的技能。 And gold farmers wouldn’t be a problem even in a closed world like WoW if it weren’t what people want.和黄金,农民会不会有问题,即使在一个封闭的世界一样,哇,如果没有什么人想。

    Of course people want game loot, but they also want to monetarize their time on line.当然,人们希望游戏哄抢,但他们也希望monetarize他们的时间就行。 If they can’t get the world to at least pay for itself, they won’t feel they can justify spending time there.如果他们不能得到世界上至少支付本身,他们不会觉得他们可以证明花费时间。

    Raph, you seem to be saying that the unfolding of events, with the Lindens taking pre-emptive action against casino advertising, with the tax man getting interested in SL, etc. that the tide is inevitable, and RMT is just not going to be able to be part of a feature set of virtual worlds. raph ,你似乎是说,开展活动,与lindens采取先发制人的行动,对赌场的广告,与税务男子越来越有兴趣在晚上八等,潮流是不可避免的,区域管理小组,只是不想被能的一个组成部分的功能集的虚拟世界。

    But I think it will always be like black markets in currencies in closed societies.但我认为它会永远像黑色的货币市场在封闭社会。 You can keep arresting and jailing people and confiscating the currency but they will just keep doing it.您可以继续逮捕和监禁的人,并没收货币但他们将只是保持这样做。 People want to be free and buy and spend as they wish.人要成为自由和购买和消费,因为他们的愿望。

  7. Raph said on raph说,

    Kami, I think there are lots of people making real world livings from worlds without RMT, and without official cash-in/cash-out (those two things are different; one happens with the world, the other happens in parallel to the world).上,我认为有很多人作出真正的世界livings从世界没有区域管理小组,并未经官方cash-in/cash-out (两件事是不同的;一发生,与世界上其他发生在平行世界上) 。 So I wouldn’t limit ourselves to cash-in/cash-out when discussing the subject.因此我不会局限于cash-in/cash-out当我们讨论的主题。

    Nor should we think that Linden has managed to resolve the legal issues surrounding the cash-in/cash-out; a lot of stuff, like the question of whether virtual worlds need to become banks, are simply unresolved at the moment.我们也不应该认为林登已设法解决法律问题的来龙去脉cash-in/cash-out ;了很多的东西,一样的问题,是否虚拟世界的需要,成为银行,只是悬而未决的于11.942美元。 Linden is definitely on the cutting edge though.林登肯定是对最前沿,虽然。 I would not minimize this as “some legal issues” — they are big big issues; that’s why Linden brings in folks like Lessig.我不会减少,这为“若干法律问题” -他们是大大的问题;这就是为什么在林登带来的乡亲一样,莱斯格。

    The notion that the real world is not “about” making money is only true in the most facile sense, that the real world isn’t about anything, you make your own goals.概念,即现实世界中是没有的“关于”赚钱是唯一真正在最简易的意识,现实世界是没有什么问题,会让您自己的目标。 However, in practice almost everyone chooses a primary or secondary goal of making money, because it supports all of their other goals, or because they really do like money.但是,实践中几乎每个人都选择一个小学或中学的目标,赚钱,是因为它支持所有他们的其他目标,或因为他们真的喜欢金钱。

    Hmm, wow. HMM的,哇。 I would not at all call it facile.我不会在所有称之为简易。 I would say that deeply and firmly I believe money is an enabler.我会说,深入和牢固,我相信钱是一个创造条件。 Most people choose money as a goal down the tree, I think, because lots of other goals take precedence over money.大多数人选择金钱,作为一个目标下树,我认为,因为很多其他的目标优先于金钱。 People earn money for things like subsistence, for education for their kids, for their hobbies, whatever.人们赚钱的东西一样,生活,教育,为他们的孩子,为他们的业余爱好,不管。 Money as a goal in and of itself is a relatively rare choice, in the population as a whole, I believe.金钱作为一个目标,并且其本身是一种比较少见的选择,在人口作为一个整体,我相信。 YMMV. ymmv 。

    I am indeed working at Areae out of love for the world.我实在工作areae走出爱的世界。 I could make more money doing something else, frankly.我可以令更多的钱做一些,否则,坦白。

    If I liked persistence, user-generated content, and property rights, I maybe would be doing something that had better support for persistence, user-generated content, and property rights.如果我喜欢的毅力,用户产生的内容和财产权利的,我也许会做一些了更好地支持毅力,使用者产生的内容,和财产权。 : ) These are hardly virtues exclusive to one platform.这些都是很难的美德,独有的一个平台。

    Look, I am not trying to minimize the fact that lots of folks do indeed make money in SL, an enjoy doing so.你看,我不是想尽量减少的事实,很多乡亲确实赚钱,在晚上八,享受这样做。 More power to ‘em.更多的权力, '教统。 I specifically said it was a red herring for metaverse worlds because SL is not the only possble model for the metaverse.我特别说,这是一个红鲱鱼为metaverse世界 ,因为SL是不是唯一的possble模型为metaverse 。

  8. Prokofy Neva said on prokofy涅瓦说,

    >I am indeed working at Areae out of love for the world. >我实在工作areae走出爱的世界。

    I Heart Raph Koster : ) i心脏raph koster : )

  9. Andy Havens said on 安迪的避风港说,

    “Enable” is a great word in this context. “启用”是一个伟大的词在这方面。 I really like what SL has done with economics, but fear that the attention to certain aspects of those features will outweigh the overall importance of them to the platform.我真的很喜欢什么思亮做了与经济,但担心该注意的某些方面,这些功能将大于整体的重要性,他们的政纲。

    Randolfe asked, at one point, in one of the long and winding posts/comments on the subject of SL economics, “Why can’t they just use $US?” Well, I think that the main issue is one of scale — there are things going for $L1, and that would be about 1/4 cent. randolfe问,在这一点上,在其中的漫长而曲折的职位/评论关于这一主题的二○ ○经济学, “为什么不能,他们只使用美元? ”好吧,我认为主要的问题是:一规模-有事情是美元的L1 ,这将是约1 / 4 。 The cost per transfer in-game of that is almost nill, but processing that in $US would be a pain.人均费用转移,在游戏中是几乎nill ,但加工,在美元将是一个痛苦。 If a bank could figure it out… more power.如果银行可以去揣摩吧…更多的权力。 Also, I think there’s the issue (as I’ve said before) of some people wanting $LD to be “gold” at all times, while other people want it to be “money” at all times, while some aren’t sure, and will make up their mind after they’ve played for awhile.此外,我认为有问题(正如我已经说过之前) ,有些人想元,劳工处将“黄金”在任何时候,而其他人希望它成为“钱”在任何时候,有些则肾脏'吨肯定,并会弥补他们心中后,他们打了片刻。 That flexibility has both advantages and disadvantages.这种灵活性既有优点和缺点。 One advantage is that people will “play” with $LD as if it’s free (it ain’t… not really), token-like stuff, and do things, and add to the overall economic-ness of the platform.一个优势是人会“玩”元,劳工处,如果它是免费的(这不是…不是真的) ,令牌一样的东西,和做的事情,并加入到整体经济性的平台。 One disadvantage is that lots of those activities, all grouped together, may *look* like similar economic activity in more robust economies… but are in fact just people “playing at buying stuff,” at least as far as they are concerned.其中一个不利因素是,很多的这些活动,所有群组在一起,可能*看看*一样,类似的经济活动在更强大的经济体系…但事实上,正义的人们“玩在买东西, ”至少就他们所担心的。

    I very much enjoy the thought experiment, “Could you make SL without its own currency?” and the corollary, “Could you make SL without any internal economic features at all?” With the addenda, “Would either of these be better?” IE, more profitable for Linden, better for the community, more long-lived, more likely to generate a wider variety of content, etc.我十分享受的思想实验, “你能不能让思亮没有自己的货币吗? ”和推论, “你能不能让思亮在没有任何内部的经济功能,在所有” ?与增编“ ,将上述两种被更好”吗?即,更有利可图的为林登,更好地为社会,更长期的生活,更可能产生一个更多元化的内容,等等。

    I have no idea.我不知道。 And, again (obviously) Onder is explicitly looking for comparisons to SL.和,再次(显然) onder是明确寻找比较晚上八。 So they have to be able to do “SLy” things in any other world.因此,他们要做到“狡猾”的东西,在任何其他的世界。 Like Raph, I think #2 and #3 are more important than #1.像raph ,我认为# 2和# 3 ,更重要的# 1 。

  10. Ace Albion said on 环境谘询委员会的阿尔比恩说,

    “I am indeed working at Areae out of love for the world. “我的确在areae工作走出爱的世界。 I could make more money doing something else, frankly.”我可以赚更多的钱做一些,否则,坦白“ 。

    But you’ll be making *some* money out of it, you hope?但是,您作出* *一些钱出来,你没有希望了吗?
    Wanting to make some money isn’t the same as chasing for the most money possible.要赚一些钱是不一样的追逐为最多钱的可能。 Some people are probably happy that they can cover their costs (perhaps making a small profit) while doing something they enjoy.有些人可能是高兴的是,他们可以支付他们的费用(也许使一个小的利润) ,而这样做的东西,它们享有。 Whether that’s socialising as a club employee, managing a land/real estate business, or making stuff.无论是作为一个社交俱乐部的雇员,管理土地/地产生意,或决策的东西。 People who enjoy what they’re doing, could make more money possibly by doing something else, but who would look for that same opportunity in another virtual world.人谁享受他们在做什么,可以赚更多的钱可能是做一些别人,但谁将寻求同样的机会,在另一个虚拟世界。

    I do like that I can create and get paid for it in SL, but to be honest, my main criterion for a replacement VW is that I’d want the same level of control over my avatar appearance as I do in SL.我想我可以创建并获得相应的报酬,这在晚上八,但老实说,我的主要标准取代大众,是因为我想要想同样水平的控制我的化身出现,像我一样在晚上八。 Picking from half a dozen stereotypes is so dull.从采摘一半十几刻板印象是如此沉闷。 After that comes the ability to create what I want, otherwise there isn’t much point besides raw socialising.后来的能力,创造什么,我想,否则是没有太大的点,除了原料社交活动。

    Also- guitars: yes, Onder Skall is specifically asking about a new guitar, not a trombone.也-吉他:是的, onder skall是专门询问了新的吉他,而不是一个长号。

  11. Wolfe said on 沃尔夫说,

    This looks like a list of symptoms to me.这看起来像清单症状给我。 What is the cause that makes people think these particular symptoms need to emerge from the product?是什么原因使人们认为这些症状的需要,特别是出现从产品?

    RMT becomes important when many enough hardcore users of the product hopes to find a better means to make money than they currently do.区域管理小组,成为重要的时候,许多不够的中坚用户的产品,希望寻找更好的手段来赚钱比他们目前正在做的。

    Without RMT my best guess says SL would have a hard time finding critical mass of hardcore users, altho there might be a few interesting types of cultures that still would be hardcore users of SL without it.没有区域管理小组,我最好的猜测说,下午将有一个艰难的寻找临界质量的中坚用户,虽然有可能是一个有趣的数类型的文化仍然会顽固的用户思亮没有它。 - Furries maybe? -f urries可能?

    I heard this morning that the swedish church is opening a church in SL and I couldnt help but giggle at such special news.我听说今天上午,瑞典教会是开放的一所教堂在晚上八,我couldnt帮助,但giggle在这种特殊的新闻。 It makes me think that it has to be really expensive for the swedish church to recruit new followers in meatspace.它使我觉得它必须是真正昂贵的为瑞典教会招募新的追随者在meatspace 。 Or its really cheap to buy things in SL… The swedish church claims that “they want to be where the people are, and thats online” (not a direct quote but something along those line translated to some attempt at english).或其真正的廉价买东西,在晚上八… ,瑞典教会声称, “他们不想被那里的人,这就是在线” (而不是直接引用,而是沿着这些路线转化为一些企图在英语) 。 If that was true they would be making guilds in WoW, but no one will make any money from running the guild of the swedish church, while someone probably sold the idea of developing church space in SL as there is a market there and some sales people have a tendency to push crap on suckers if they can.如果这是真正的,他们会作出协会在哇,但没有人会做出任何金钱,从运行协会,瑞典教会,而有人可能出售的想法发展空间教会在晚上八作为是有市场的存在和一些销售人有一个趋势,推动crap就吸孔,如果他们可以。

    Those who spend money on SL property seem to hope they are buying some magic future value.这些谁拿钱思亮财产似乎希望他们购买一些魔术的未来价值。 Generally it appears to be clueless people who expect their SL investment to cash out or gain value over time.一般来说,似乎是不懂的人谁期望他们的投资思亮出来,以现金或收益的价值随着时间的推移。 In reality it seems more likely that the value of any digital asset asymtotically approach zero over time.在现实中似乎更有可能的价值,任何数字资产asymtotically的做法,零时间。 The real value is the enjoyment of the people who use the thing.实质价值,是享受的人谁使用的事。

    Supporting RMT is for sales people a system import, kindof similar to how Fifa 2007 is a system import for sports or soccer people.支持区域管理小组是为销售人的制度,进口, kindof类似如何国际足联2007是一个系统的进口为体育或足球的人。 RMT is a very interesting system to play with, its difficult to actually practice real world economics elsewhere in such a free form as you can when making a living through the VW / eBay circus.区域管理小组是一个很有趣的系统发挥,其困难的做法,其实真正的世界经济在其他地方,例如免费的形式,您可以在决策时的生活,通过大众/易趣马戏团。

    Maybe you can even go as far as claiming that these three points are the tree official game systems of SL.也许你可以去,甚至就声称这三点是树的官方游戏系统的晚上八。 As a player you can probably focus your gaming experience towards playing the RMT game, the IP game or the persistence game.作为一名球员,您可以大概的重点您的游戏体验,对发挥区域管理小组的游戏,游戏的IP或持续的游戏。 Not very far from how an mmorpg player can play the crafting game, the levelling game or the raid game.不会很远,如何从一mmorpg Player可以播放该工艺的游戏,铲平游戏或行动的游戏。 Most players dabble in all but lean more towards one or the other.大多数球员在所有涉足,但精益更对一个或另一个。

    An interesting aspect on these parts of a VW is that neither of the mentioned features will be involved with a new users first 5 minutes of experience.一个令人感兴趣的方面对这些零件的大众,就是谁也不肯上述功能都将被涉及的一个新的用户首先在5分钟的经验。 The 5 critical minutes that converts a trialist to a user fails to show core functionality during the trial, for both SL and the mmorpg. 5分钟的关键转换trialist向用户未能显示的核心功能在审判期间,无论SL和该mmorpg 。

    As the radio reporter who mentioned the news about the Swedish church said this morning, she got bored after 2 minutes of trying to figure out what this very hip SL thing really is.作为广播电台记者谁提到的消息,瑞典教会说,今天上午,她厌倦在2分钟后试图弄清楚是什么,这很髋关节晚上八件事是真的。

  12. Tess said on 苔丝说,

    Yeah, I would’ve taken Onder to task on #1, too, except, as he points out, he’s considering these three items to be metrics of SL-likeness — not necessarily a recipe for making future games of SL’s ilk.是啊,我会已采取onder任务就# 1 ,太,除,正如他所指出的那样,他的考虑到这3项被度量○ ○ -相似性-不一定是食谱,使未来的游戏思亮的之流。 Though, given that, I’m surprised he didn’t add:虽然,鉴于,我很惊讶他没有地址:

    4.) There must be a graphical client. 4 )必须有一个图形用户端。

    …since persistent, player-modifiable text games have been around forever (though very few of them have any substantial RMT market to speak of). …以来,持续,球员可塑性的文字游戏,已经永远左右(虽然很少,他们有任何实质性的区域管理小组市场可言) 。

  13. Kami Harbinger said on 上预示着说,

    Raph wrote: raph写道:

    Kami, I think there are lots of people making real world livings from worlds without RMT, and without official cash-in/cash-out (those two things are different; one happens with the world, the other happens in parallel to the world).上,我认为有很多人作出真正的世界livings从世界没有区域管理小组,并未经官方cash-in/cash-out (两件事是不同的;一发生,与世界上其他发生在平行世界上) 。 So I wouldn’t limit ourselves to cash-in/cash-out when discussing the subject.因此我不会局限于cash-in/cash-out当我们讨论的主题。

    Raph, a free market in the virtual world is simply not practical without at least some system integration to the real-world economy. raph ,一个自由市场在虚拟世界中根本没有实际没有至少有一些系统集成到真实世界的经济。 As Andy said, many things are available for less than US$1.00; I sell my simpler gadgets for L$250, a good price for 50 or 100 lines of code, but even that ~US$1.00 is only barely practical for Paypal.作为安迪说,很多事情是供小于1.00美元;我卖我简单的小工具,供升250元,一个良好的价格为50或100行代码,但即使这样, 〜 1.00美元,只是勉强的实际,为贝宝。 Cheaper items like t-shirts or bottles of beer (decorative but socially valuable props) can’t be run by microtransactions on Paypal.便宜的项目,例如T恤或瓶啤酒(装饰,但在社会上宝贵的道具)不能运行,由microtransactions对贝宝。 Yet people would like to be able to sell those things.然而,人们希望能够出售这些东西。

    The alternative to an official, integrated RMT, is to have a black market RMT.另一位官员,综合区域管理小组,是为了有一个黑色的市场区域管理小组。 You will always have RMT, because you can’t stop us.你将永远有区域管理小组,因为你不能阻止我们。 Better to embrace it, and make people happy, than to fight them and make them resent you.更好地拥抱它,使人民幸福,比打他们,令他们反感你。

    It is of course possible for developers to make money from virtual worlds even if they don’t have an internal economy or in-world private property, but it is not possible for the vast majority of people to easily and casually make a bit of money from their creativity without it.这当然是可能的发展要赚钱,从虚拟世界,即使他们没有有一个内部经济或在世界的私有财产,但它是不可能为广大人民群众能够更轻易随便作出了一点钱从他们的创造力没有它。 How do you get singers in your nightclubs and let them take tips without RMT?你怎么得到的歌手在您的夜总会,让他们采取的秘诀,没有区域管理小组? How do you let people create and sell paintings and sculptures and weird gadgets without RMT?你怎么让人们创造和出售的绘画和雕塑作品和怪异的小工具,没有区域管理小组? I am not in the least interested in a centrally-controlled artistic cathedral; I like a vast bazaar of creative amateurs, with everyone able to make what they like, so I can choose the stuff I like, and present my work for others.我不是在最不感兴趣的一个中央控制的艺术大教堂;我喜欢广阔的市场创意业余爱好者,大家能够作出他们喜欢什么,所以我可以选择的东西,我喜欢,目前我的工作给别人。

    Hmm, wow. HMM的,哇。 I would not at all call it facile.我不会在所有称之为简易。 I would say that deeply and firmly I believe money is an enabler.我会说,深入和牢固,我相信钱是一个创造条件。 Most people choose money as a goal down the tree, I think, because lots of other goals take precedence over money.大多数人选择金钱,作为一个目标下树,我认为,因为很多其他的目标优先于金钱。 People earn money for things like subsistence, for education for their kids, for their hobbies, whatever.人们赚钱的东西一样,生活,教育,为他们的孩子,为他们的业余爱好,不管。 Money as a goal in and of itself is a relatively rare choice, in the population as a whole, I believe.金钱作为一个目标,并且其本身是一种比较少见的选择,在人口作为一个整体,我相信。 YMMV. ymmv 。
    I am indeed working at Areae out of love for the world.我实在工作areae走出爱的世界。 I could make more money doing something else, frankly.我可以赚更多的钱做一些,否则,坦白。

    So you are giving up all profit from Areae, and donating it to a Center for Metaversal Studies?所以你放弃了所有的利润从areae ,并捐赠给中心metaversal研究? Using it to house homeless avatars?用它来内务无家可归的造型精灵?

    Perhaps you really are not motivated by money, but this is a vanishingly rare lack-of-motivation.也许你真的不是出于金钱,但,这是一个难得的vanishingly缺乏的激励。 Usually, the only people who tell you that money isn’t important are either incredibly poor and without any skills or talents (”I bet those grapes are sour anyway”); or con artists and preachers and “motivational speakers” who want to take your money (”Jayzus needs Cadillacs!”).通常情况下,只有人民谁告诉你,钱不是重要的是,无论是令人难以置信的贫穷和没有任何技能或人才( “我敢打赌,这些葡萄是酸的,无论如何” ) ;或诈骗犯和传教士和“动机的发言”谁想要采取你的钱( “ jayzus需要cadillacs ! ” ) 。 You’re not either, and while I criticize some of your decisions, you are not without skills… So that’s quite unusual, and kinda weird.您也不是,虽然我批评您的一些决定,你是不是没有技能…使的,显得相当不寻常,和kinda怪异。 You’re not paying a lot of attention to what people say and do, if you don’t think money as a motivation is ubiquitous.您不是付出了很多注意什么人说和做,如果你不认为金钱,作为一个动机是无处不在。

    Money has been a really big deal for the vast majority of humans for the 5000 years or so since average human wealth exceeded the “am I going to starve to death this week?” level.钱已经一个真正的大不了,对于绝大多数的人类,为5000年多以来,人类的平均财富超过了“我会饿死在本星期” ?水平。 Money gives you something wonderful: choices.钱给你一些美好的:选择。 Money is freedom.钱是自由。 You don’t just have whatever you can grow or make for yourself, but can trade for the interesting things other people grow or make.你不只是有什么你可以成长或作出为自己,但可贸易有趣的事情,其他人的成长,或作出。 The power and magic of shopping , in real life or Second Life, never fails to entertain me, and keeps me going to work.权力和魔术般的购物 ,在现实生活中或第二次生命,永远不会失败受理我,和我不断去工作。 I certainly do not write financial database webapps for fun; I do it because they pay me extremely well, and this lets me buy shiny new toys.我当然不写金融数据库webapps乐趣,我这样做,因为他们的薪酬我非常好,这让我购买全新的玩具。 While I make stuff in SL for fun, I would work considerably less hard (and enjoy it less) if I wasn’t paid for it.虽然我做出的东西在晚上八为了好玩,我会的工作相当少的努力(和享受,它以较低者为准) ,如果我不支付。 Making something is fun.使事情是好玩。 Making something and getting paid for it is AWESOME.决策的东西,并获得付款的,因为这是可怕。

    In any case, the people who are in Second Life tend to be rather more mercenary than average.在任何情况下,人民是谁在第二生命也往往是较为雇佣军高于平均水平。 Despite the capability of living entirely for free in SL, almost nobody does, because capitalists have more fun, and make the world more fun for others.尽管生活的能力,完全免费,在晚上八,几乎没有人去做,因为资本家有更多的乐趣,和使世界更有趣别人。

    If I liked persistence, user-generated content, and property rights, I maybe would be doing something that had better support for persistence, user-generated content, and property rights.如果我喜欢的毅力,使用者产生的内容,权利和财产权利,我也许会做一些了更好地支持毅力,使用者产生的内容,权利和财产权利。 These are hardly virtues exclusive to one platform.这些都是很难的美德,独有的一个平台。

    Well, that’s an interesting claim.那么,这是一个有趣的说法。 Because as Onder’s list and analysis shows, those virtues are exclusive to one platform.因为onder的名单和分析表明,这些美德独有的一个平台。 Only Second Life so far meets the requirements of being Second Life.只有第二生命,至今会见的要求,正在第二次生命。 There.com is pretty close, but it’s hideously ugly, making products there is really slow, because they have to be approved, there’s no adult content, and there’s no legal RMT, so it’sa pain in the ass to get any money. there.com是相当接近,但它的hideously丑陋,使产品实在是慢,因为他们要获得批准,有没有成人内容,而且也没有法律区域管理小组,所以这是疼痛,在驴得到任何金钱。

    Look, I am not trying to minimize the fact that lots of folks do indeed make money in SL, an enjoy doing so.你看,我不是想尽量减少的事实,很多乡亲确实赚钱,在晚上八,享受这样做。 More power to ‘em.更多的权力, '教统。 I specifically said it was a red herring for metaverse worlds because SL is not the only possble model for the metaverse.我特别说,这是一个红鲱鱼为metaverse世界,因为SL是不是唯一的possble模型为metaverse 。

    And if that was ever the claim, you’d have a point there.如果这是以往任何时候都声称,您有一个点。 But Onder’s not only never said that it was for every possible virtual world, he in fact has repeated at length that it’s about alternatives to Second Life, for Second Life residents, who want, you know, Second Life (or something indistinguishable from it).但onder的,不仅从来没有说过这是为一切可能的虚拟世界,他在事实上已经多次在长度,它的关于替代第二生命,为第二生命的居民,谁不想,你知道,第二生命(或一些区分它) 。 Gosh, it’s almost as if Second Life residents like the features of Second Life! gosh ,它的几乎一样,如果第二生命的居民一样的特点,第二次生命!

    When every SL resident here repeats that they like money and RMT… Maybe you should take us at our word.晚上八时,每一个居民在这里重申,他们喜欢金钱和区域管理小组…也许你应该采取我们在我们的话。 Doesn’t mean you have to make Area exactly like SL.并不意味着你必须作出面积完全一样晚上八。 Nobody’s asking you to.没有人要求你。 You do lose out on the “alternative places for Second Life residents” market, but we already have SL, so that’sa poor market to enter, anyway.你失去列于“另类的地方为第二生命的居民”的市场,但我们已经有思亮,所以that'sa穷人的市场进入,无论如何。

  14. Rich Bryant said on 丰富的科比说,

    Prok wrote: prok写道:

    RMT *is* what people want.区域管理小组* *是什么人想。

    RMT is what SOME people want.区域管理小组是什么有些人想。 Not very many, to judge by SL’s user stats.不是很多,法官由晚上八的用户统计。 WoW and other actual games are different - there what people want is stuff.哇和其他实际游戏是不同的-有什么人想是的东西。 They can get that stuff (illegally under the games’ ToS) via RMT.他们可以拿到的东西(非法下的游戏'服务条款)通过区域管理小组。

    But they don’t want the RMT for itself, they just want the stuff.但他们不想区域管理小组本身,他们只是想要的东西。

  15. Kami Harbinger said on 上预示着说,

    You might want to read those user stats again, Rich; it’s currently over 1.7M active (last 60 days) users, and still growing at a rapid rate.您可能想要阅读这些用户统计再次,丰富的,它的目前有超过一点七米活跃(去年为60天)的用户,仍然是增长速度迅速。

    What exactly do you think people, however many there are, do with money in SL?究竟你认为人们,然而,许多有,与金钱在晚上八? Just roll around in it?刚才辊左右在它呢? No, we buy stuff.没有,我们买的东西。 I mostly buy original artwork and Japanese furniture for my office, some nice clothes, and spend a lot tipping live musicians and DJs. i大多是购买原来的插图和日本的家具我的办公室,一些很不错的衣服,并且花了很多小费生活的音乐家和的DJ 。 I also cash out to pay my tier and make some money on the side; I might be willing to pay for Second Life, but I don’t have to, because it pays me.我也现金支付我的三层,并提出一些钱放在一边,我可能会愿意支付的第二生命,但我不要,因为它支付了我。

    And who do you think is engaging in the other side of the WoW RMT?和谁,你认为是从事在对方的区域管理小组哇? Other rich first-world players who simply have too much Gold burning a hole in their pockets?其他富国第一世界的球员谁只是有太多的黄金烧了一个洞,在他们的口袋? No, a lot of them are people in third-world countries doing it for a living.没有,其中许多是人们在第三世界国家,做一个生活。 They kill monsters to get some high-level loot that people want (cornering the market if possible), auction it for as much Gold as possible, then sell it to other people for US$ so they can eat.他们杀死的怪物,得到一些高层次的掠夺,人们想要(垄断市场,可能的话) ,拍卖为多黄金作为可能,然后出售给其他人的美元,使他们能够吃的了。 The gold-sellers sure do want the RMT in and of itself.金卖方肯定想区域管理小组,并且其本身。 Their customers tend to be people who have money but insufficient free time to do the endless level grinding necessary to get stuff without RMT, ie, rich first-worlders.他们的客户往往被人谁有钱,但足够的空闲时间做无休止的水平磨削要得到的东西,没有区域管理小组,即先富起来- worlders 。 Without RMT, they’re not playing, because only children have the spare time to do well in WoW without it.没有区域管理小组,他们不是在玩,因为只有儿童有空闲时间要做好在没有哇。 Without RMT, those third-world goldsellers go back to a textile mill, or a field, or maybe starve to death, rather than playing videogames for a living.没有区域管理小组,这些第三世界国家goldsellers回去一纺织厂,或外地,或可能饿死,而不是玩游戏为生活。 RMT makes a hell of a lot bigger difference to their lives than it does to yours.区域管理小组作出了地狱了很多较大的差异,以他们的生命比它到您的网站。

Meta中继

Recent Comments最近的评论

Categories类别

Recent Trackbacks最近trackbacks

Archives档案



点击这里访问metaplace网站

3d web art games community management disney fiction flash game design game grammar game industry game politics gdc indie games laws of online world design legendmud metaplace metaverse metric verse