[...] There’s a fairly long discussion of the site (and similar sites) over at Raph Koster’s blog: http://www.raphkoster.com/2007/02/21…the-top-again/ __________________ [Web Developer and RPG Fanatic] AW Dot [...]

If you’re a game developer, what “rest of your time”?

If you’re a consumer, how much time do you have?

Seriously, though. Look at how much time casual gamers spend playing casual games. Grinding on a camp wasn’t a whole lot different than playing a casual game for hours on end (and some of those gamers do).

Main point being, a badge grant there removes the gameplay I had been enjoying.

Though of course, other times I’d much prefer the badge.

Or some different casual games, for that matter.

When I first picked up Vice City for my PS2, I had two friends over for extended periods of time. We constructed an elaborate series of rules for when control passed from one of us to the other, which could be boiled down to “pass the controller when you are wasted, get busted, successfully complete a mission, or have had control for twenty minutes” with a long series of “except” after each of the conditions. Between the three of us, we hammered the game to 100% complete in about a week.

This is the most fun I have had with a game since 1997 and to date. Think about that: the most fun I have had in any game over the past ten years was NOT built into the game. It was an artificial social construct which the game neither understood nor enforced. The average MMO tries to prevent this. You play for the goals they set, and any sort of meta-gaming is subject to disciplinary action when people complain. Indeed, account sharing itself is forbidden. This arbitrary limitation essentially limits the amount of fun players can have.

Dr. Cat is picking at the edge of a very important issue. If we get enough people picking at the edges, it will peel back and we’ll uncover something very important – a major part of the magic that can make MMOs much more interesting (MMI MMOs!) and consequently more successful/profitable.

True, but imitating the tool does not teach you the craft. Look at Saint’s Row; it has almost all of the tools that make up GTA, yet somehow, it isn’t even remotely as interesting. As a game developer, I’m intrigued by some of the new systems they’ve created, and I like the way they’ve got some of the infamy and reputation ideas implemented. As a player, I laugh far too much when I ram into other cars and the drivers go flying through the windshield. There are good pieces in SR. A lot of good pieces. If you dissect it into a checklist, it’s got everything GTA has and more.

But it just doesn’t have the magic. There’s something missing. SR simply is not as good as GTA. Everyone who plays it knows this. GTA4 will turn SR into a historical footnote, but SR hit the market at the best possible time: roughly a year before GTA4 would release, and slightly after the message of “no GTA for a year” sank into the average gamer’s head. So lots of people bought it, and it’s certainly better than nothing at all.

The key element of imitation is that it is a process which forms PART of learning. You can’t learn exclusively by imitation. You must imitate, then ask why what you have imitated works, and how you can improve it. It is the improvement process which teaches; I can’t play Paganini’s 5th Caprice in A Minor, but I can imitate some parts of it, and I’ve learned a great deal about harmony and tonal structure by extending those parts in other directions. One such experiment led me to a series of connect-the-dots mutations that culminated in a sudden grasp of David Gilmour’s stylistic roots, and a series of original licks that might well have appeared on a 1976 Pink Floyd album. This process of learning is fundamentally different from the “woodshedding” I’ve done to learn the solo from Comfortably Numb; having done that some years ago, I didn’t really learn jack shit. I just chopped it up and dropped pieces of it into my playing, essentially sampling it. But what taught me to grasp the foundation of that style was a measure and a half of classical music combined with four to five hours of play. That “moment of clarity” kind of learning doesn’t happen if you simply imitate. Imitation is good, and can lead to great things, but it can’t stand on its own.

WRT Dr. Cat’s insight, ONLINE games are about meeting people. And it’s interesting to me that most online games are functionally about competing with those people, not collaborating with them. Even when we collaborate, it is to compete with other teams. I always preferred the MUSH style RP-based gaming, where your advancement was directly correlated to the frequency of productive interaction with others.

GAMES ARE ABOUT MEETING FRIENDS TOO

Some friends like to buy things together (or whatever motivation shopping fulfills). Other friends like to compete or work as a team. There are many motivations that we can design to appeal to.

Cafe.com obviously is designed to appeal to the friends that likes to spend money together on game activities. Getting to the “top” in this game space is not the same as getting to the “top” of games like WoW, so the value and opposition to RMT will be different too.

Sometimes accomplishment is not the focus of the game. Sometimes it’s the journey and social aspect of the game.

For example, I expect casual and social driving games that have great graphics and real driving routes to be a hit in the Western markets. Winning races, getting the best gear, or other type of forms of accomplishment will not be the key focus for this game. Self-expression via car & avatar design, riding together, experiencing an event together will be the focus. And if they want to pay $1 to be able to experience virtually the winner’s lap at Indy 500, why not let them spend that $1.

Frank

It resonates very strongly for me with my most recent insight (or at least distillation of past thoughts into a short, graspable quote.) I think one of the very most basic truths a designer should embrace is:

GAMES ARE ABOUT MEETING PEOPLE.

This was not what games were about in the past. But they are increasingly what they are about now, and will be even more so in the future. Fail to recognize this reality at risk of being left behind in the never-ending race for “the ultimate game design”.

But then whatever would I do with the rest of my time?

If you’re a game developer, what "rest of your time"?

If you’re a consumer, how much time do you have?

I was a little proud of how long I could go without sleep, but the real accomplishment was finding those camp sites while all the other folk tripped over each other at the same over-crowded spots every other player was working.

We could do a badge for THAT, rather than just for the grinding!

But then whatever would I do with the rest of my time?

I’m with ya on getting new ponies, but can we keep that one, too?

Sure…

I was a little proud of how long I could go without sleep, but the real accomplishment was finding those camp sites while all the other folk tripped over each other at the same over-crowded spots every other player was working.

We could do a badge for THAT, rather than just for the grinding!

I don’t think there’s an MMO out right now with a defined “endgame” (raiding, PvP, whatever) that effectively transitions players from the beginning solo/group activities into the endgame.

Hmm, I think the various embedded economic games and political games actually do it fairly smoothly.