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	<title>Comments on: EA buys Mythic</title>
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	<link>http://www.raphkoster.com/2006/06/20/ea-buys-mythic/</link>
	<description>Raph Koster's personal website: MMOs, gaming, writing, art, music, books</description>
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		<title>By: Kaledor</title>
		<link>http://www.raphkoster.com/2006/06/20/ea-buys-mythic/comment-page-1/#comment-9748</link>
		<dc:creator>Kaledor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 01 Jul 2006 12:19:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.raphkoster.com/2006/06/20/ea-buys-mythic/#comment-9748</guid>
		<description>Mythics 150K subscription rate is more than enough to keep Mythic going.  Go back to 2001, Mythic only needed 50K player base to make a profit... Over the past years they are doing very well.  They are paying for Warhammer out of pocket.

Is Warhammer going to do well, yes, how well, only will know when the game comes out.  I say it will break 1 million subscribers.  If they do the subscriptions counting like WoW, they will probably break 4 million subscribers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mythics 150K subscription rate is more than enough to keep Mythic going.  Go back to 2001, Mythic only needed 50K player base to make a profit&#8230; Over the past years they are doing very well.  They are paying for Warhammer out of pocket.</p>
<p>Is Warhammer going to do well, yes, how well, only will know when the game comes out.  I say it will break 1 million subscribers.  If they do the subscriptions counting like WoW, they will probably break 4 million subscribers.</p>
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		<title>By: holysin</title>
		<link>http://www.raphkoster.com/2006/06/20/ea-buys-mythic/comment-page-1/#comment-9618</link>
		<dc:creator>holysin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jun 2006 10:57:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.raphkoster.com/2006/06/20/ea-buys-mythic/#comment-9618</guid>
		<description>pantomimeHorse, reduce the time to get to the end-game? If anything, WOW is too fast to acomplish that.
And, no matter what kind of end-game a game has, most people enjoy killing for experience, and not doing Instances dozens (of hundreds) of times just to get a piece of epic armor.

If anything, there shouldn&#039;t be an end-game and no level cap. Sure, the hardcore would become very powerful in the game, but knowing that there are people with a higher level than you shouldn&#039;t affect your enjoyment of the game. The only problem would be balancing PvP (and, for fuck&#039;s sake, NO CHAOS PVP only, like lineage 2).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>pantomimeHorse, reduce the time to get to the end-game? If anything, WOW is too fast to acomplish that.<br />
And, no matter what kind of end-game a game has, most people enjoy killing for experience, and not doing Instances dozens (of hundreds) of times just to get a piece of epic armor.</p>
<p>If anything, there shouldn&#8217;t be an end-game and no level cap. Sure, the hardcore would become very powerful in the game, but knowing that there are people with a higher level than you shouldn&#8217;t affect your enjoyment of the game. The only problem would be balancing PvP (and, for fuck&#8217;s sake, NO CHAOS PVP only, like lineage 2).</p>
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		<title>By: pantomimeHorse</title>
		<link>http://www.raphkoster.com/2006/06/20/ea-buys-mythic/comment-page-1/#comment-9538</link>
		<dc:creator>pantomimeHorse</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Jun 2006 00:06:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.raphkoster.com/2006/06/20/ea-buys-mythic/#comment-9538</guid>
		<description>I think the way to kill WoW is pretty clear: you have to out-WoW WoW, i.e. do to WoW what WoW did to EQ.

First and foremost this means reducing the time-to-end-game by at least an order of magnitude and providng people with something to actually do when they get there. In fact, leveling up should be treated more like an extended tutorial, a SP game within the game that gently exposes people to working with/against other players. If a class-based game, expect that devoted players won&#039;t want to have to decide between classes except perhaps which to try first, and making it much quicker to max out a character helps in this regard.

Make the end-game revolve around player conflict, not gear and economy. The only hard part here is how to a)emphasize player conflict without frustrating/disinvolving the less-skilled/time-strapped players, and b) introduce an element of persistance and progress to invest players in-between playing sessions.

Don&#039;t make players be encyclopedists/trivia-mavins, e.g. &#039;What mob do I kill in what zone to farm ingrediant x to make thing-a-ma-jig y that gives me a +3 sta upgrade&#039;.

Farming for gear is bad. Farming for quests is worse. Farming for single-use items is evil. (I mean both farming for these things directly or farming for gold for these purposes.)

Favor quest-quality/diversity over quantity. Perhaps each level can have one single quest that is class specific. Sure that means everyone ends up doing the same small set of quests, but this is no loss when the alternative is meaningless quests. Those players who want to spoil the story elements will do so, but at least this way, those players not inclined to do so might actually get a story worth not spoiling.

Fill the world with mini-games that utilize the core-mechanics (a la WoW&#039;s battlegrounds), and make sure players don&#039;t have to wait forever to find opponents/teammates).

Get rid of fillers (like eating/drinking and no-skill farming/gathering).

Aside from all this, obviously you must meet par with Blizzard on two things: 

Shiny. (fun look/sound, but don&#039;t require cutting-edge hardware)

Accessable. (easy to get into)

So I think the path is pretty clear, though as I admitted, discovering how to fill in that blank of &#039;what to do in the end-game&#039; isn&#039;t going to be easy. If EA doesn&#039;t interfere, WHO might just do it. If not, I imagine Blizzard itself will take things along this direction, either by making a WoW sequel or changing WoW.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think the way to kill WoW is pretty clear: you have to out-WoW WoW, i.e. do to WoW what WoW did to EQ.</p>
<p>First and foremost this means reducing the time-to-end-game by at least an order of magnitude and providng people with something to actually do when they get there. In fact, leveling up should be treated more like an extended tutorial, a SP game within the game that gently exposes people to working with/against other players. If a class-based game, expect that devoted players won&#8217;t want to have to decide between classes except perhaps which to try first, and making it much quicker to max out a character helps in this regard.</p>
<p>Make the end-game revolve around player conflict, not gear and economy. The only hard part here is how to a)emphasize player conflict without frustrating/disinvolving the less-skilled/time-strapped players, and b) introduce an element of persistance and progress to invest players in-between playing sessions.</p>
<p>Don&#8217;t make players be encyclopedists/trivia-mavins, e.g. &#8216;What mob do I kill in what zone to farm ingrediant x to make thing-a-ma-jig y that gives me a +3 sta upgrade&#8217;.</p>
<p>Farming for gear is bad. Farming for quests is worse. Farming for single-use items is evil. (I mean both farming for these things directly or farming for gold for these purposes.)</p>
<p>Favor quest-quality/diversity over quantity. Perhaps each level can have one single quest that is class specific. Sure that means everyone ends up doing the same small set of quests, but this is no loss when the alternative is meaningless quests. Those players who want to spoil the story elements will do so, but at least this way, those players not inclined to do so might actually get a story worth not spoiling.</p>
<p>Fill the world with mini-games that utilize the core-mechanics (a la WoW&#8217;s battlegrounds), and make sure players don&#8217;t have to wait forever to find opponents/teammates).</p>
<p>Get rid of fillers (like eating/drinking and no-skill farming/gathering).</p>
<p>Aside from all this, obviously you must meet par with Blizzard on two things: </p>
<p>Shiny. (fun look/sound, but don&#8217;t require cutting-edge hardware)</p>
<p>Accessable. (easy to get into)</p>
<p>So I think the path is pretty clear, though as I admitted, discovering how to fill in that blank of &#8216;what to do in the end-game&#8217; isn&#8217;t going to be easy. If EA doesn&#8217;t interfere, WHO might just do it. If not, I imagine Blizzard itself will take things along this direction, either by making a WoW sequel or changing WoW.</p>
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		<title>By: RENEGADES - View topic: EA acquire Mythic entertainment - By us for us</title>
		<link>http://www.raphkoster.com/2006/06/20/ea-buys-mythic/comment-page-1/#comment-9521</link>
		<dc:creator>RENEGADES - View topic: EA acquire Mythic entertainment - By us for us</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Jun 2006 17:39:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.raphkoster.com/2006/06/20/ea-buys-mythic/#comment-9521</guid>
		<description>&lt;!--%kramer-ref-pre%--&gt;[...] This hasn&#039;t been met with much bliss in the press, mainly because EA have a tendancy to buy up and then scrap long-term MMO because they don&#039;t have the market knowledge to back it up (aka: Kesmai syndrome).   http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kesmai   http://www.raphkoster.com/2006/06/20/ea-buys-mythic/ [...]&lt;!--%kramer-ref-post%--&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<div style="padding:15px; border-left:1px solid #dedede; border-bottom:3px solid #CCEBF7; background-color:#fcfeff">
<p><!--%kramer-ref-pre%-->[...] This hasn&#8217;t been met with much bliss in the press, mainly because EA have a tendancy to buy up and then scrap long-term MMO because they don&#8217;t have the market knowledge to back it up (aka: Kesmai syndrome).   <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kesmai" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kesmai</a>   <a href="http://www.raphkoster.com/2006/06/20/ea-buys-mythic/" rel="nofollow">http://www.raphkoster.com/2006/06/20/ea-buys-mythic/</a> [...]<!--%kramer-ref-post%--></p>
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		<title>By: Raaka</title>
		<link>http://www.raphkoster.com/2006/06/20/ea-buys-mythic/comment-page-1/#comment-9507</link>
		<dc:creator>Raaka</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Jun 2006 09:11:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.raphkoster.com/2006/06/20/ea-buys-mythic/#comment-9507</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s interesting what EA sees in this deal, hopefully they&#039;re not expecting to go head to head with WoW. I was hoping WAR to be less for massmarket and resurrect PVP again, but I don&#039;t think there&#039;s hope for that now.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s interesting what EA sees in this deal, hopefully they&#8217;re not expecting to go head to head with WoW. I was hoping WAR to be less for massmarket and resurrect PVP again, but I don&#8217;t think there&#8217;s hope for that now.</p>
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		<title>By: Slyfeind</title>
		<link>http://www.raphkoster.com/2006/06/20/ea-buys-mythic/comment-page-1/#comment-9445</link>
		<dc:creator>Slyfeind</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Jun 2006 01:07:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.raphkoster.com/2006/06/20/ea-buys-mythic/#comment-9445</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ll never forget one of the early chats you came to, Raph. There were so many questions and concerns, people were screaming about this and that, and I belive you said something like, &quot;Guys, please! Nobody has ever done something like this before!&quot;

We could all have lost confidence in UO at that point. But in context, it came across as rather inspiring.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ll never forget one of the early chats you came to, Raph. There were so many questions and concerns, people were screaming about this and that, and I belive you said something like, &#8220;Guys, please! Nobody has ever done something like this before!&#8221;</p>
<p>We could all have lost confidence in UO at that point. But in context, it came across as rather inspiring.</p>
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		<title>By: Raph</title>
		<link>http://www.raphkoster.com/2006/06/20/ea-buys-mythic/comment-page-1/#comment-9436</link>
		<dc:creator>Raph</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 Jun 2006 18:08:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.raphkoster.com/2006/06/20/ea-buys-mythic/#comment-9436</guid>
		<description>Oh, I should add that not only was EA completely clueless about what we were doing when making UO, so was most of Origin. UO really was a skunkworks thing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh, I should add that not only was EA completely clueless about what we were doing when making UO, so was most of Origin. UO really was a skunkworks thing.</p>
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		<title>By: Raph</title>
		<link>http://www.raphkoster.com/2006/06/20/ea-buys-mythic/comment-page-1/#comment-9433</link>
		<dc:creator>Raph</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 Jun 2006 17:42:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.raphkoster.com/2006/06/20/ea-buys-mythic/#comment-9433</guid>
		<description>As Kristen says, EA bought Origin long before UO (the one we know) was even started. There had been daydreams around earlier, but none of them ever got started.

OWO was just a domain name that Origin bought to host UO servers, at a time where there were hopes of making more than one virtual world. We ran it as a rogue domain with a rogue FAQ that quite horrified the marketing department.

The initial money for UO, legend has it, came directly from EA with a &quot;special projects&quot; sort of check provided by Larry Probst. It was relatively little -- $1m, I think -- and Richard Garriott is the one who went to bat to get it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As Kristen says, EA bought Origin long before UO (the one we know) was even started. There had been daydreams around earlier, but none of them ever got started.</p>
<p>OWO was just a domain name that Origin bought to host UO servers, at a time where there were hopes of making more than one virtual world. We ran it as a rogue domain with a rogue FAQ that quite horrified the marketing department.</p>
<p>The initial money for UO, legend has it, came directly from EA with a &#8220;special projects&#8221; sort of check provided by Larry Probst. It was relatively little &#8212; $1m, I think &#8212; and Richard Garriott is the one who went to bat to get it.</p>
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		<title>By: Kristen</title>
		<link>http://www.raphkoster.com/2006/06/20/ea-buys-mythic/comment-page-1/#comment-9431</link>
		<dc:creator>Kristen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 Jun 2006 17:39:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.raphkoster.com/2006/06/20/ea-buys-mythic/#comment-9431</guid>
		<description>Whoa! Hold on there... EA actually purchased Origin Systems  Inc. in 1992. well before UO began as a &quot;garage&quot; project stuffed away in the attic in 1995.

I&#039;d say the real decline of these types of games shouldn&#039;t be blamed on whichever monolithic corporation is at the top of the food chain (really they&#039;re more interested in bottom lines than lines of code or dialog). Problems arise when internal management tries to meet that bottom line and hit an arbitrary date on the fiscal calendar by any means necessary often sacrificing potential for money in hand.

It also seems to happen when the development team no longer has their hand on the rudder, and it&#039;s turned over to a &quot;live&quot; team and the original vision, passion and drive is lost, diluted or just heads off in a different direction from what the playerbase originally signed up for.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Whoa! Hold on there&#8230; EA actually purchased Origin Systems  Inc. in 1992. well before UO began as a &#8220;garage&#8221; project stuffed away in the attic in 1995.</p>
<p>I&#8217;d say the real decline of these types of games shouldn&#8217;t be blamed on whichever monolithic corporation is at the top of the food chain (really they&#8217;re more interested in bottom lines than lines of code or dialog). Problems arise when internal management tries to meet that bottom line and hit an arbitrary date on the fiscal calendar by any means necessary often sacrificing potential for money in hand.</p>
<p>It also seems to happen when the development team no longer has their hand on the rudder, and it&#8217;s turned over to a &#8220;live&#8221; team and the original vision, passion and drive is lost, diluted or just heads off in a different direction from what the playerbase originally signed up for.</p>
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		<title>By: Amaranthar</title>
		<link>http://www.raphkoster.com/2006/06/20/ea-buys-mythic/comment-page-1/#comment-9425</link>
		<dc:creator>Amaranthar</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 Jun 2006 15:16:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.raphkoster.com/2006/06/20/ea-buys-mythic/#comment-9425</guid>
		<description>My understanding was that Origin sold to EA to raise the money to make UO, before UO went into earnest production. It was EA&#039;s money that made UO possible. 

Whether it was a contractual obligation to EA rather than a real desire is something I don&#039;t know. Or rather, how the scales tipped on the subject. It seems obvious from various sources that some people at EA didn&#039;t believe in the idea of UO, but I doubt everyone was unified in their thinking.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My understanding was that Origin sold to EA to raise the money to make UO, before UO went into earnest production. It was EA&#8217;s money that made UO possible. </p>
<p>Whether it was a contractual obligation to EA rather than a real desire is something I don&#8217;t know. Or rather, how the scales tipped on the subject. It seems obvious from various sources that some people at EA didn&#8217;t believe in the idea of UO, but I doubt everyone was unified in their thinking.</p>
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